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Pak Sanusi has had his own stall in the Jalan Pramuka bird market since 1992. His father started the business and not only passed on a passion for songbirds, he passed on the family business as well.

But what lurks behind the bright feathers in one of the city’s busiest bird markets is something Sanusi isn’t too keen on talking about, a trade that involves more than just canaries and cockatiels.

What’s the most expensive bird you sell at your stall?

The anis, which goes for Rp 5 million ($535).

What do you base a bird’s value on?

Most of the time, on how well it sings. The price depends on how well a bird has been trained to sing. Obviously, untrained birds cost less than one that can sing beautifully. The anis is well-trained. One that can’t sing will cost you around Rp 500,000.

How long have you been running this stall?

Since I graduated from high school in 1992. I joined my father that year and later took over the family business.

Here at your own stall, how many birds do you have?

About 50. They’re mostly canaries and wamay, a bird from Hong Kong.

When is your shop busiest?

Over the weekends, which is when most of the tourists come. Sometimes they buy birds, sometimes they just want to take pictures.

Do you sell anything besides birds?

No, I don’t. Not me personally. I only sell birds and cages, but there are guys in the area who sell monkeys. There are about 150 monkeys being sold in this market.

How about orangutans? Is it true that orangutans are sold in a market like this?

I’ve seen tame orangutans being sold here. Ones that have been around people since they were babies. A tame orangutan costs about Rp 50 million, while a wild orangutan costs Rp 20 million. Not many people are interested in buying a wild orangutan, though. The ones that have been in captivity all their life just want to hug and hold on to you.

What’s the orangutan trade like?

In 2002, some people from Madura came here to our market and sold orangutans openly. But it’s getting tougher now. The orangutans are being hidden somewhere else. They don’t remain at the market because of the police. So if someone is interested to buy an orangutan, we have to talk to the clients first, interrogate them, gather evidence and make sure they’re not undercover cops. Sometimes, environmental police come to the market and raid the stalls. Some of them like to pose as buyers for sting operations.

How about cockfighting? Do you sell birds for that?

No, not me. I mean there are a few roosters here, but you can get all kinds of breeds in Jatinegara. There’s a group of guys there who sell roosters and engage in gambling as well. What they sell are very valuable birds. Sometimes, customers like to try and buy winning birds, but the owners aren’t exactly quick to sell them.

Why are some of the cages here at your stall covered?

To keep the birds inside them from constantly singing. There are songbird competitions here in the city. The national competition, called the President’s Cup, is going to be held on Dec. 13 at Gelora Bung Karno in Senayan.

Does the chirping of thousands of birds ever get to you?

No. In fact, I love it. I love that they sing all day. If the sound got to me, I wouldn’t be working here. And if the birds didn’t sing, they wouldn’t sell.

How many birds do you have at home? Do you have any favorite birds?

I have 25 to 30. My favorites are the muray batu, white-rumped shama thrush and the anis.

Do you sell any endangered species of birds?

Yes. Sometimes I sell peacocks or birds of paradise, from Papua. I also sell cockatoos.

Are you worried at all about bird flu?

Not now. We were worried about it back in 2004, and it was very bad for business. We couldn’t import any foreign birds. But it’s safe now because the virus is totally under control. And if there’s a breakout, we have the medicine for it.